tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post6702862809262882631..comments2023-11-02T06:57:11.400-04:00Comments on BookEnds Literary Agency: The Meaning of DifferentBookEnds, A Literary Agencyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06287278822065839469noreply@blogger.comBlogger96125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-91779532118991780532009-07-13T03:22:49.395-04:002009-07-13T03:22:49.395-04:00Well, I am a reader not writer or agent. Sadly the...Well, I am a reader not writer or agent. Sadly the books I read are cross genre so I must like Beef Stew ice-cream which actually sounds revolting! A bit of a downer to be told my reading habits are ridiculous.! Luckily there are agents out there who do cater for what might appear to be my specialist taste. The post feels like too ideas conflated into one. Or maybe the Beef Stew remark was meant to get people thinking in which case I think it was a very successful post. <br />I certainly hope that books don't go to ebook format completely so the question of what an agent can sell as book going on to a bookshelf has to be an important issue. As an artist from a different genre, (singer) yes I definitely think that just being an 'artist' is not enough. For a start it's the perfect way to get reamed. So with regard to that portion of the blog doing your homework as a writer seems apt in whatever way you can. Interesting blog!Tinukehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15858453216657116282noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-16739487919729831022009-07-10T00:44:40.479-04:002009-07-10T00:44:40.479-04:00Ho, ho ho, Chi Minh . . .
Readers don't know ...Ho, ho ho, Chi Minh . . .<br /><br />Readers don't know what they like until some hype burglar tells them so; or until they read it -- not necessarily in that order. <br /><br />And neither do you!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-73246142311595706882009-07-08T19:17:57.840-04:002009-07-08T19:17:57.840-04:00Why wouldn't an agent want what they can sell?...Why wouldn't an agent want what they can sell? I don't understand anyone thinking that isn't what an agent wants.<br /><br />Publishers don't want to make books that can't sell- so they aren't going to pick them up from agents. It's an agents job to guess which books a publisher will buy and go from there. <br /><br />That's that.~Jamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08872228115110257474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-7572280534025343062009-07-08T18:55:17.573-04:002009-07-08T18:55:17.573-04:00""this agent" thinks that Pride and...<i>""this agent" thinks that Pride and Prejudice with Zombies is exactly what I was talking about, but not as beef stew ice cream. That book is the absolute perfect example of Strawberry Marscapone with Chunks of Sugar Cookie."</i><br /><br />Have you read it??? While it is a financial success, the book itself is complete crap. Are you saying that what you are looking for as an agent is poorly written trash with a quirky topic?<br /><br />Again, that would be the Beef Stew ice cream you started out saying you didn't want and not the Strawberry Cookies that you can tell right from the description will be a big hit.<br /><br />Not to get stuck in a discussion of one book... <br /><br />I still see an essential problem with your initial post. You are saying you want 'The Same Only Different' because as an Agent you know that 'The Same Only Different' is what you can sell to publishers and I'm sure you do a credit to your clients by picking clients who are writing books you know you can sell.<br /><br />The problem is (as other people have mentioned) that book sales are down. The public isn't buying 'The Same Only Different' in the kind of numbers they were two years ago and <b>that</b> is why you need to be keeping your eye open for the Bacon Flavored Ice Cream that everyone wants, but doesn't know they want yet.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-26271264777571902432009-07-08T17:35:05.555-04:002009-07-08T17:35:05.555-04:00Broccoli-cumin? Come on, you made that whole thin...Broccoli-cumin? Come on, you made that whole thing up.<br /><br />It was, however, a really funny and clever story that made some good points. <br /><br />Nice job. Two thumbs up.Mirahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558405035294107657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-12604997174450824332009-07-08T13:48:16.929-04:002009-07-08T13:48:16.929-04:00I have a friend who once opened an ice cream store...I have a friend who once opened an ice cream store.<br /><br />The first week, the delivery driver left ten gallons each of vanilla, chocolate, raspberry, strawberry and tequila-jalapeno ice cream.<br /><br />The next week, the driver returned and saw that all the flavors, except tequila-jalapeno, had sold out. Still, his instructions were to leave ten gallons of each flavor, each week.<br /><br />After about two months, my friend was beside herself. She usually sold out of chocolate by Friday evening, subsequently losing customers, and she was beginning to have storage space problems with the build up of tequila-jalapeno.<br /><br />Still, when the driver showed up each week, he insisted on leaving ten gallons of each flavor.<br /><br />"But you only sold ten gallons of chocolate last week," he'd tell my friend. "Why do you want more?"<br /><br />After much cajoling, she finally elicited from him a promise 'to look into it'.<br /><br />So, what DID he do? Two things. First, he decided to spend a whole bunch of money marketing tequila-jalapeno ice cream, because clearly it wasn't that it was just crappy ice cream; he LOVED it, and was sure everybody else would, too! People just needed to be convinced to buy it. Second, he told my friend to reduce the size of her chocolate scoops -- without, of course, lowering the price -- because the supplier had diverted chocolate production capacity to tequila-jalapeno in anticipation of the marketing campaign's success.<br /><br />His first step was to put up a big poster, showing a delicious, glistening scoop of tequila-jalapeno under the heading "Our #1 Bestselling Flavor"*. His second step was to reduce deliveries of every other flavor, making tequila-jalapeno the only thing in the cooler by the time the weekend rolled around.<br /><br />By definition, buyers can only buy what's for sale, and sales of tequila-jalapeno at first skyrocketed. But soon, people just stopped coming to my friend's store. Eventually, she convinced the supplier to renew her supplies of chocolate, vanilla, raspberry and strawberry. When the truck showed up, the new delivery driver threw in ten gallons of broccoli-cumin. He just LOVED it, and was sure it would be the next big thing.<br /><br />Sigh.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-46930937583599280592009-07-08T05:55:26.660-04:002009-07-08T05:55:26.660-04:00Jamie,
I want value-for-money, too, but one of the...Jamie,<br />I want value-for-money, too, but one of the non-negotiable qualities in books is that I want to be intrigued. I have experience enough as a reader and writer to be able to predict far too many tropes and plots, and I am bored with them. I want to read books I could not have thought up, which means a wider range of characters and lifestyles and worlds than we often see.<br /><br /><i>It's our job as writers not just to write what we want, but to write what we think the public wants to read...</i><br /><br />Ptui.<br /><br />It is my job as a writer to stay true to the story. It is also my job not to stand between the reader and the story - which means honing my craft so my words deliver exactly what I want them to say, which means not making the reader work to compensate for my lack of skills, which means finding the right level of diction, style, pacing, level of details, viewpoint etc etc for the story, which means not abusing the reader's trust for my own amusement.<br /><br />I also owe it to readers not to patronise them by deciding what they want or don't want to read.green_knighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16499896006012152260noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-78830920812791141902009-07-08T02:39:27.235-04:002009-07-08T02:39:27.235-04:00I have to say... I order the same thing at restaur...I have to say... I order the same thing at restaurants, I buy clothes from stores I know make good quality stuff, and I see movies from the same directors... why?<br /><br />Because I don't want to waste my cash- I work hard for that stuff- I want to be pleased when I spend it.<br /><br />I am not saying I want to read the same book again and again... but I want to read things that are familiar in tone and feeling.<br /><br />It's our job as writers not just to write what we want, but to write what we think the public wants to read... and if we know kids are reading the paranormal- rather it be vampire, warewolf, or superhero- then we should write that. <br /><br />Kids love trends... do you think it was a GOOD idea to tight roll your jeans, or did Misty's cousin's roommate from college tell you to do it-so you did? <br /><br />The want to follow things-they want catch phrases and styles, they want characters they can relate to, but not so much it bores them.<br /><br />I think a lot of the authors out there are trying to stretch the envelope for the sake of telling people they stretched it, and they have every right to... but will an agent take on your book? Uh-no. An agent is in the business of making money off books and cultivating best selling authors, not making sure you get to see your memoirs of a tube sock in print.~Jamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08872228115110257474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-73573932854052443682009-07-07T21:10:46.225-04:002009-07-07T21:10:46.225-04:00I'm with green_knight. I'd definitely try ...I'm with green_knight. I'd definitely try the weird ice creams. I'm one of those people that goes to restaurants and orders the thing on the menu I've never heard of and can't pronounce.<br /><br />I've heard of raspberry blue cheese ice cream, but must admit I never ate it. I'm not a raspberry fan.<br /><br />My all time favorite dessert to date is an heirloom tomato tart with basil gelato and basil syrup. The tart was sweet, like berries. The waiter said he had a hard time getting people to try it, but everyone who did thought it was the most amazing thing they'd ever eaten.<br /><br />I like to broaden my horizens in my reading too.Judithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16354890444410748967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-87059420095618428742009-07-07T18:46:12.487-04:002009-07-07T18:46:12.487-04:00Actually Anon 6:24:
"this agent" thinks...Actually Anon 6:24:<br /><br />"this agent" thinks that Pride and Prejudice with Zombies is exactly what I was talking about, but not as beef stew ice cream. That book is the absolute perfect example of Strawberry Marscapone with Chunks of Sugar Cookie. It's just the perfect blend of different. It's not trying to reinvent the wheel in any way, but taking what has already worked and worked very well and creating your own unique version.<br /><br />--jhfBookEnds, A Literary Agencyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06287278822065839469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-81666681707332253672009-07-07T18:24:26.656-04:002009-07-07T18:24:26.656-04:0010:57:
I will never, ever buy a zombie book about...10:57:<br /><br /><i>I will never, ever buy a zombie book about Jane Austen characters nor a book about teen vampires.</i><br /><br />You might not buy a book about zombie Jane Austen characters, but millions of other people have and that <b>IS</b> another example of why this Agent is <i>so</i> wrong -- someone took a chance and put that Beef Stew ice cream on the shelf with a fancy looking cone and it was a smash success.<br /><br />The book itself is complete trash. The writing is piss poor and the idea falls flat on its literary face before you can even enjoy the face munching zombie goodness, but that didn't keep millions of people from taking a taste.<br /><br />It was the impossible mix of flavors that no one thought anyone wanted and it turned out that everyone did.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-70225779127407776862009-07-07T16:04:46.354-04:002009-07-07T16:04:46.354-04:00Ok. So I wander into an ice cream parlour. And I&#...Ok. So I wander into an ice cream parlour. And I'll have a scoop of something I know I'll love at the bottom of the cone, because I know I'll love it, and a scoop of roasted eggplant because that's so weird I just have to try it. And if that isn't there, I'd have a scoop of Beef Stew because I really cannot imagine that I would like it, but it's so weird, I need to find out how anyone thought it would work. (I've bought drinks and crisps and - gasp - icecream like that. Just because it's there. And Heston Blumenthal's restaurants do a roaring trade, and he's far weirder.)<br /><br />But give me an icecrem shop full of chocolate, vanilla, strawberry and I'll walk past. Tried them, don't particularly mind them, but I've eaten them often enough that I'll hold out for the next shop that hopefully will have something different. Offer me Black Raspberry Chocolate Cheesecake and Strawberry Marscapone with Chunks of Sugar Cookie and I'll look at it: cheese? Why do these people keep putting cheese into everything? I hate cheese. I want to buy cheese-free icecream! And I want to buy a nice, solid flavour, not fruit-with-something-with-sugar amalgamations that sound as if they'll taste mainly of sweet and artificial flavouring. And I'll walk straight out of the icrecream shop if those flavours are too prominent, and I won't come back.<br /><br />This analogy is very, very apt indeed. In the last couple of weeks I spent five hours browsing high street bookstores and come out with zero books, because they're full of (well, actually, not very full right now, the shelves looked stripped) of books that all sound the same and all don't sound like something I want to read. So I, a certified readaholic, read what's on my shelves and visit second-hand bookstores and borrow from friends and order on the internet through personal recommendation, because I can't get the style of books I like at all on the highstreet.<br /><br />And now, I *really* want that roasted eggplant icecream, because roasted eggplant has that sweetish undertaste that might actually work. Probably not on par with the chocolate-with-chilli icecream that was to die for...green_knighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16499896006012152260noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-32922159191507839412009-07-07T12:01:35.836-04:002009-07-07T12:01:35.836-04:00As a huge Jane Austen fan, I was at first put off ...As a huge Jane Austen fan, I was at first put off by the zombie connection. But the idea has grown on me and my online book club is going to read the book. It's sort of like the Oprah thing. I bought the book because I love P&P, not for the zombies. <br /><br />It might be fun. Remember fun? Isn't that what all of this is supposed to be about? I know it's a business, but if you can't have some level of fun, why bother?Dawn Mariahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12065998860801658132noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-76517667287917725172009-07-07T11:47:42.159-04:002009-07-07T11:47:42.159-04:00Book sales have been down in recent years because ...Book sales have been down in recent years because of two things: 1) younger generations were watching more television, spending a lot of time on the computer, and reading less 2) the economy sucks.<br /><br />Now, for the first time in a very, very long time young adult sales are up. What are they reading? A lot of paranormal. It's my hope that this means reading is back in vogue and will lead to better sales for many, many types of books as this generation grows up. It's certainly an encouraging trend. Those "zombie books" that you refuse to buy may very well be revitalizing the entire book market.<br /><br />I, for one, don't buy the argument that book sales are down because there aren't any good books to buy. But if you want to try and prove it, go and self-publish, sell millions of copies and then come back and convince me.Kim Lionettinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-32773489802630913172009-07-07T11:40:32.719-04:002009-07-07T11:40:32.719-04:00Oh, ridiculous, Anon 10:57.
If Oprah told people ...Oh, ridiculous, Anon 10:57.<br /><br />If Oprah told people to read the Yellow Pages, it would skyrocket to the top of the Best Seller list. People don't read books she recommends because they crave quality. They read them because they adore her.<br /><br />People buy teen vampire books and zombie classics because they are being entertained by them, because their friends are reading and recommending them. <br /><br />Your argument that if more "of quality" like Pillars of the Earth were published, then people would gravitate toward that instead of the pop culture, mind candy books is simply nonsense! There is always quality being published, and there's always mind candy, and people read what they want to read. More people want to read the mind candy -- and always have!<br /><br />You may not like it, but that's the audience. It would be a foolish publisher who ignored that.Melissa Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13560125503655770461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-78564069803142439372009-07-07T10:57:36.386-04:002009-07-07T10:57:36.386-04:00My point is that, numbers don't lie. Book sal...My point is that, numbers don't lie. Book sales are down and there is a reason for it. We all may have our theories, but mine is that sales are down because agents and publishers are looking for "new and different" instead of tried and true quality. Publishing should look for the type books it was producing when sales were higher, not continue to produce books from a period when sales are low.<br /><br />I will never, ever buy a zombie book about Jane Austen characters nor a book about teen vampires. I buy what I like to read and when there is nothing good out there to read then I buy nothing. I am an example why book sales are down. Sure, there are some who will buy those books, but obviously the number of people buying those books is lower than the number of people buying the tried and true books of the past; this fact is confirmed by the declining sales figures. You can squawk all you want that the best sellers are these new kind of books, but some book has to be a best-seller, no matter who many actual sales there are.<br /><br />Ken Follett's Pillars of the Earth is a perfect example. Because of exposure on Oprah's Book Club more potential readers found out about it and rocketed it to best-seller status again. That's a 15-year-old book written the way books should be written. If more of those type books were published today, teen vampire books and zombie classics would not sell because readers would have a far superior product to purchase. Enough said!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-75928939011880963702009-07-07T07:32:43.562-04:002009-07-07T07:32:43.562-04:00"Kim by your tone you seem to hate authors.&q..."Kim by your tone you seem to hate authors."<br /><br />Okay, I have no idea how you got that from my comment. If that were the case, I'd sure be in the wrong business, wouldn't I?<br /><br />My point is this: Everybody has their own tastes and their own opinions on what should be in bookstores. One commenter wants more of the same, another wants stuff that's dramatically different. But the publishing industry's best reference guide to what the book-buying public wants is sales records. And that dictates what editors are looking for and hence what agents are going to send their way. Any one of us could shout from the rooftops "We want something different!", but our shouts just aren't going to be as loud as those sales numbers, because publishing is, after all, a business. We'd just sound like a vocal minority.Kim Lionettinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-31157837147081449872009-07-07T07:01:12.024-04:002009-07-07T07:01:12.024-04:00I was gonna say the same thing about HP. I mean, h...I was gonna say the same thing about HP. I mean, how many boarding school stories were there before HP? How many stories about a boarding school which taught magic? HP just added its own spin, its own elements - its own flavour.Catherinehttp://catherine-haines.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-59421465433388790982009-07-07T06:21:38.200-04:002009-07-07T06:21:38.200-04:00Anon 11:55:
Actually Harry Potter and Twilight ar...Anon 11:55:<br /><br />Actually Harry Potter and Twilight are perfect examples of exactly what I am talking about. They are the same, but different. They are, to a certain degree, traditional stories with a new and unique twist and done in such a way that they captivated the audience that was already there. <br /><br />Sometimes it's difficult to explain myself unless you can truly spend time in my query inbox. However, I do think that those of you who get it do get it and yes, as Heather said, I certainly agree in cross-genres. If you take a quick glance at my list you'll see I've been doing those books for quite sometime and it's because of the cross-genres that I've become more and more interested in fantasy. However, it's the author who tries hard to make a book a little bit of everything to please everyone rather then focusing on one thing and making it different that has the most trouble.<br /><br />--jhfBookEnds, A Literary Agencyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06287278822065839469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-56686944183466442322009-07-07T01:03:44.538-04:002009-07-07T01:03:44.538-04:00A+! Love the ice cream comparison, and the comment...A+! Love the ice cream comparison, and the comment about writers who don't read. Is there a worse moment than talking to a writer who has re-written a book that is already out there and finding out they don't know it?Lorelei Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07639663436142251951noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-75367297920833795912009-07-07T00:04:01.801-04:002009-07-07T00:04:01.801-04:00Don't forget. At one time people thought pist...Don't forget. At one time people thought pistachio ice cream was horrible and disguisting. What you think of today as different and unsalable is what may become the mainstream tomorrow.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-31844042764722458442009-07-07T00:02:13.975-04:002009-07-07T00:02:13.975-04:00Different means you still have to appeal to reader...<i>Different means you still have to appeal to readers. A book that the author labels as a mystery, romance, science fiction is not different, it’s ridiculous.</i><br /><br />I can understand how a “mystery-romance-science fiction” marketing label, even if it accurately describes the content, isn’t conducive to the brick and mortar business model of selling books (digital publishing and ecommerce, with its reliance on search engine technology, might be a different story). <br /><br />I can understand how using multiple genre terms to pitch or sell a book can be convoluted as well as an ill-advised strategy for authors (which is what I think you mean by the above statement. Otherwise, it seems as though you are saying that books involving multiple genres are ridiculous). <br /><br />But there are so many cross-genre books in existence, and when I describe a book I’ve read to a friend, I’ll often remark on the cross-genre elements contained therein since those are the books I enjoy reading. I don’t stick to the marketing label on the spine. <br /><br />And I happen to love books that contain mystery, romance, and science fiction. I don’t think my reading tastes are ridiculous.<br /><br />There is an audience for Beef Stew Ice Cream—even if only someone like Willy Wonka could pull it off—but the manufacturer wouldn’t necessarily call it that. What a book actually is and how a publisher markets it can sometimes be two totally different things.<br /> <br />Wasn’t paranormal romance its own Beef Stew Ice Cream at one time? It went from a dead market to having its own shelving in bookstores. The authors found their audience, albeit the audience grew in large part by reader-driven endeavors such as magazines (LoveLetter), and online communities (PNR).Heather Masseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00913459109753829391noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-85109512866555741752009-07-06T23:55:29.684-04:002009-07-06T23:55:29.684-04:00Boo-hoo, some poor agent doesn't want to think...Boo-hoo, some poor agent doesn't want to think outside the box.<br /><br />I'm going to have to disagree with this post. Readers DO NOT buy 'the same only different' they also buy things that are totally different and unique.<br /><br />At one time Harry Potter was new and Twilight was new. Now they are a dime a dozen.<br /><br />Every trend started out as something new and later became mainstream and that is ignoring the success of books like House of Leaves and The Raw Shark Texts that are totally outside the mainstream and yet are both critical and financial successes.<br /><br />What I see here is an agent who sees that publishers are buying lots of YA books and lots of Vampire books (and even YA vampire books) and doesn't want to put in the effort to look for those one or two unique projects that might come across her desk that could make both her and the author very wealthy. <br /><br />Keep looking at 'the same only different' and you will miss the next Harry Potter or the next Twilight (or even the next House of Leaves) and it will be some other agent who gets rich off of 'The Next Big Thing'.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-70645497727997868662009-07-06T23:32:59.271-04:002009-07-06T23:32:59.271-04:00Maybe that's the problem--not the genre, but t...Maybe that's the problem--not the genre, but the predictability of the plot. <br /><br />The last book I read was such a downer that I doubt I'll read that author's next book.<br />Who needs more doom & gloom?<br /><br />ps/ Why would anyone say Kim hates authors based on her comment? Makes sense to me...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-50253459920015762162009-07-06T23:30:07.329-04:002009-07-06T23:30:07.329-04:00Please explain why this post doesn't completel...Please explain why this post doesn't completely contradict the last one.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com