tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post5981411941364351366..comments2023-11-02T06:57:11.400-04:00Comments on BookEnds Literary Agency: Does Ageism Exist in Publishing?BookEnds, A Literary Agencyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06287278822065839469noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-13840843147730221162008-07-12T19:03:00.000-04:002008-07-12T19:03:00.000-04:00Thanks for raising an important issue. If age dis...Thanks for raising an important issue. If age discrimination were really a bad thing, it would not be so popular everywhere in the business world. We get so hung up on quality and performance we forget age is really the important thing. Age discrimination needs to be rehabilitated. We need to recognize age for the outstanding screening tool that it is. Age. Focus on it. Use it.<BR/><BR/>If I were an agent I would not sign anyone younger than 50.<BR/><BR/>Sorry, kids. Maybe when you’re older.Steve Stubbshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10051363877066768708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-56818273798948094612008-07-10T12:31:00.000-04:002008-07-10T12:31:00.000-04:00It's hard for me to imagine my world without havin...It's hard for me to imagine my world without having read, then listened to, Angela's Ashes. I guess Frank McCourt didn't get the memo about being too old.<BR/><BR/>Then, again, Mary Higgins Clark is how old?<BR/><BR/>What the younger than I am folks should keep in mind<BR/>is when you get to be my age, you won't think you are old at all ... but the younger than you are, will.<BR/><BR/>How you treat us now, will come back to you then.<BR/><BR/>Be smart!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-5531563237999287442008-07-09T10:57:00.000-04:002008-07-09T10:57:00.000-04:00"Anonymous said... In the "good old days," when so..."Anonymous said... <BR/>In the "good old days," when someone at a dinner party brought up a novel they were reading, everyone jumped into the fray, talking enthusiastically about that and other books they were reading. Sadly, that hasn't happened, at least for me, in a very long time.<BR/><BR/>With publishers (and some agents) focusing on celebrity memoirs, gossipy tell-alls and putting marketing budgets behind writers deemed worthy by virtue of their youthful good looks, willingness to disrobe for the cover while eschewing books written by writers above a certain age, is it any wonder publishing is in trouble?"<BR/><BR/>I couldn't agree more with you. And that's why, this year, I started my own little experiment. I'm only reading fiction that I decide is right for me, and I'm going after it. I've been seeing so many self-published writers for so many years pushing their books, I decided it was time I started to choose my own reading material, suited to my own tastes, and not the tastes of an agent or editor. And so far, twenty self-published novels into the experiment, I'm pleased with most. But more than that, I'm seriously confused as to why these writers have not been published and why they don't have agents.<BR/><BR/>I have worked as an editor and writer in the publishing industry for a long time, and I've never self-published anything of my own. I'm looking at the self-published material I read strictly as entertainment. So for anyone who IS interested in reading fiction and not being disappointed completely each time you spend money, start going after your own books (you can start by clicking on the names of commentors on blogs) instead of trusting the subjective tastes of so-called publishing professionals. You will be very surprised at the good material out there that has been ignored.<BR/><BR/>It's also empowering to know that we have choices now, and that we are not at the mercy of what a handful of people think we should be reading. There are some really good books out there you don't want to miss.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-26327992987822503612008-07-09T07:49:00.000-04:002008-07-09T07:49:00.000-04:00"It’s real. It hurts. I made the mistake of meetin..."It’s real. It hurts. I made the mistake of meeting my dream agent face-to-face at a conference. Her shock and disappointment were obvious. Despite all her previous interest and encouragement, a few days later I received a generic “not right for us” letter."<BR/><BR/>This is a little scary. I'm planning on going to the Surrey conference and now I wonder if that is wise. Of course, I really had no expectations of interesting an agent there, but it worries me now.<BR/><BR/>Ah, well. I can't change my age. I have to live with it and make sure my work is compelling enough.<BR/><BR/>I'm in my fifties and getting ready to start taking sword fighting lessons. I guess someone forgot to tell me to act my age. Or, maybe I'm going through my second childhood.Julie Weathershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13725236516593676381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-33606489575706032302008-07-09T04:00:00.000-04:002008-07-09T04:00:00.000-04:00Now it's become the norm to put photos of authors ...Now it's become the norm to put photos of authors on the back inside covers of many books, it's not easy to hide your age - unless you use a gorgeous stand in! I always wondered why we need a photo. The book is all that matters.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-4814269825830560332008-07-08T22:39:00.000-04:002008-07-08T22:39:00.000-04:00Growing old is always better than the alternative....Growing old is always better than the alternative. It saddens me that anyone would judge a person by something as arbitrary as the number of years they've lived. How very shallow.<BR/><BR/>If a person should feel my age is somehow an impediment to my career, I don't want to work with said person anyway.<BR/><BR/>And, as many have pointed out, why would I want to "retire" from writing at any age?Elissa Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10727748060605823895noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-59994009442324928882008-07-08T20:17:00.000-04:002008-07-08T20:17:00.000-04:00The big question I have is: How does anyone know y...The big question I have is: How does anyone know your age? I guess if you go to a conference, and they see you in person, they can guess. Or if you're already published with some success--there would be publicity photos and interviews where your age would be at least estimated.<BR/><BR/>But for me, I finished my first novel ms at age 30, sent it out to agents, got some partials and one full request, but never sold it--nor did my age ever come into play (never asked, never told).<BR/><BR/>Now I'm 40 and currently shopping a 3rd ms (never sent #2 out), getting considerably more action on this one--but once again--age has never come into play--never asked, never told.<BR/><BR/>So, for me, anyway, I can't see how age is a factor whatsoever when I've never been asked how old I am, nor volunteered the info. All professional discussions I've had this far have centered exclusively on the work itself, nothing else.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-71587665353313366832008-07-08T19:14:00.000-04:002008-07-08T19:14:00.000-04:00OooooOooo, one more thing...How could a writer sto...OooooOooo, one more thing...<BR/>How could a writer stop writing no matter what age they reach? The stories don't stop flowing just because of a number.<BR/>I rejoice in my age! Each new year is an adventure. <BR/><BR/>I choose an agent on how many deals they've got under their belt and what kind of authors are in their stable. I don't care how old or young they are.Aimlesswriterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03012050763172251381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-38632801268601816692008-07-08T19:02:00.000-04:002008-07-08T19:02:00.000-04:00ok, hide my age, don't tell anyone I have kids in ...ok, hide my age, don't tell anyone I have kids in their twenties, and slather anti-age cream in the crease! <BR/>Yikes! I never thought this would matter. Most writers keep writing till they're old and well, really old, don't they? <BR/>Think of the experience with older writers. We've seen a lot, dealt with all kinds of peeps and probably forgot more then those younger have even seen.Aimlesswriterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03012050763172251381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-4374566547723555142008-07-08T19:00:00.000-04:002008-07-08T19:00:00.000-04:00I pretty much decided I wanted to be a writer stra...I pretty much decided I wanted to be a writer straight out of high school. I enrolled in a college writing course that was mostly made up of mature-age students. I remember one day we had a guest speaker who was a published author (of only one book, mind you, but he was so up himself you would have thought he'd written 10 best sellers) who had the very set opinion that anyone under 30 couldn't write anything WORTH publishing becuase they didn't have enough life experience. Needless to say since I was only 20 it pissed me off and I was detirmined to prove him wrong and get my work published. <BR/>Well, today I'm a lot closer to 30 than 20, but I've still got a bit of time up my sleeve!<BR/>In saying all of that, I've seen personally in many different aspects how people have been totally ageist against me becuase I'm so young... or was! <BR/>In terms of an agent's age, this wouldn't bother me. I'm more interested in who she's represented, which houses she works with, what she can do to get my work out there. If she's doing that at 25, then good luck to her because she'll probably be very, very successful.Jess Anastasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01925359822909924087noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-3838105758528486832008-07-08T17:30:00.000-04:002008-07-08T17:30:00.000-04:00Karen, you beat me to it. I thought I was being cl...Karen, you beat me to it. I thought I was being clever. Okay, we're both clever...Sandra Cormierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00231342310371529022noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-60262319932355521512008-07-08T17:29:00.000-04:002008-07-08T17:29:00.000-04:00I love telling people my age because they say I lo...I love telling people my age because they say I look ten to fifteen years younger.<BR/><BR/>I certainly hope I don't have to face ageism in my quest for a good writing career. Maybe we have nothing to worry about anyway since fifty is the new forty.Sandra Cormierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00231342310371529022noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-23841311219668856542008-07-08T17:19:00.000-04:002008-07-08T17:19:00.000-04:00When you said something about a 19-year-old I had ...When you said something about a 19-year-old I had a moment of panic. I never thought about my age being an issue, but I understand that some people will see it as one. Being 19 can help me and it can hurt me. I haven't "seen the world", but I know how teenagers think, talk, and interact. Writing a book at my age is hard work, it is at any age, but I'm at the point where there are a thousand things I want to do with my time, and yet, I put those things aside to write.Christinahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17804563972250353887noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-15219324791853444212008-07-08T16:27:00.000-04:002008-07-08T16:27:00.000-04:00Just remember, Charles Darwin was 50 when he wrote...Just remember, Charles Darwin was 50 when he wrote the Origin of Species.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-9587893844535960842008-07-08T16:18:00.000-04:002008-07-08T16:18:00.000-04:00I'll just use pictures of my youngest daughter, wh...I'll just use pictures of my youngest daughter, who's 24. She looks exactly as I did at her age. Ha! 8^)<BR/><BR/>I can't imagine anyone retiring at age 62, but I suppose it happens. What would you do with yourself? I'd be bored silly. I'll be writing until my fingers stop working, and even then I might start using voice recognition software.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, the concept of age is changing. 40 is the new 30, 50 is the new 40, etc. etc.Karen Duvallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01839711547501582977noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-58924907810242352352008-07-08T15:08:00.000-04:002008-07-08T15:08:00.000-04:00I have a good friend who writes and produces plays...I have a good friend who writes and produces plays and runs an acting studio - he's in his 70's. He's retired from the "day job" (teaching), but he's still going strong in the career he loves best.<BR/><BR/>If I were able to make a living writing, I'd hardly consider retiring at 62 - because it's not really "work" when it's something you love.Sarah J. MacManushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03430266551248332700noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-62240435785842648342008-07-08T12:41:00.000-04:002008-07-08T12:41:00.000-04:00In the "good old days," when someone at a dinner p...In the "good old days," when someone at a dinner party brought up a novel they were reading, everyone jumped into the fray, talking enthusiastically about that and other books they were reading. Sadly, that hasn't happened, at least for me, in a very long time.<BR/><BR/>With publishers (and some agents) focusing on celebrity memoirs, gossipy tell-alls and putting marketing budgets behind writers deemed worthy by virtue of their youthful good looks, willingness to disrobe for the cover while eschewing books written by writers above a certain age, is it any wonder publishing is in trouble?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-54842740113930187392008-07-08T12:34:00.000-04:002008-07-08T12:34:00.000-04:00So often I would hear people exclaim about what a ...<I>So often I would hear people exclaim about what a baby I was or how young I looked or ask outright my age. I knew this put me at a disadvantage. </I><BR/><BR/>I'm in the same boat appearance-wise, and this is exactly why I don't plan to reveal my age in my cover letter. (I never really did in the first place, because, as you said, I wouldn't put it in any cover letter for a job application, as it's not relevant.) The writing should be what sells, not how long it might be until I kick the bucket.Kristin Laughtinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01536556357622503501noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-82668954104720108922008-07-08T12:17:00.000-04:002008-07-08T12:17:00.000-04:00I read that Writers digest article and shuddered. ...I read that Writers digest article and shuddered. Not much hope for me, eh? Grin. But I still persist.<BR/>It's hard for we writers who are still struggling to get a foot in the door while looking at retirement looming ahead. We suffer ageism on many levels.<BR/><BR/>I tell myself that life experience counts in writing. Maybe it does, or maybe it locks you into a past lifestyle that is passe. I think the key is to stay engaged in life, be active, keep on experiencing. <BR/><BR/>I can see both sides of the story, the agent/editor wanting to help build the author's career, looking for longevity of career. But life happens. I'm sure there are many aspiring youthful authors who get sucked into life's vortex and write one book. Or never finish their first manuscript until their kids end up in college. An agent/editor could take on someone who is forty and they put out a couple of books and find they have nothing left to give. Or the one book wonder. Or the extremely slow writer who puts out a book every three years.<BR/><BR/>Its all about how much passion you have about writing, how determined you are, how tenacious and how much imagination and creativity you can tap into. Writing isn't just for the young. It's something you can keep doing until your eyes give out and your fingers stiffen up with arthritis. Hell, then you could hire someone else to type and just dictate. <BR/><BR/>The book should be all that counts. Not how you look, how old you are, who you you know in the business. I don't care if a book is written by someone fifteen or fifty-five, if it's a good yarn it's good.Robena Granthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18389730409379890816noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-20884693463038770182008-07-08T11:46:00.000-04:002008-07-08T11:46:00.000-04:00It’s real. It hurts. I made the mistake of meeti...It’s real. It hurts. I made the mistake of meeting my dream agent face-to-face at a conference. Her shock and disappointment were obvious. Despite all her previous interest and encouragement, a few days later I received a generic “not right for us” letter.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-75769402953605335032008-07-08T10:43:00.000-04:002008-07-08T10:43:00.000-04:00I was feeling pretty depressed until I read Kate D...I was feeling pretty depressed until I read Kate Douglas' comment. <BR/><BR/>I will never tell anyone my age (I’m really old, but don’t look it). Not that I'm ashamed of the number. Quite the contrary. But if people knew, they'd say things like, "How's your pacemaker doing?" <BR/><BR/>Your age alters the way people think of you. All I can say is, if you're old, try not to become hypnotized by the number.Tena Russhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08630397939303203418noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-28905754210711890532008-07-08T10:39:00.000-04:002008-07-08T10:39:00.000-04:00Thank you for responding to my concerns. The book ...Thank you for responding to my concerns. The book in question dealt with a lot of freelancers' concerns (focusing on magazine writing), but there was also a lot dealing with book publishing. <BR/><BR/>It's funny. I had gotten over the usual worries unpublished writers have -- manuscript formatting, including SASEs, how to find an agent -- but worrying about my age blindsided me, I guess because I've been working for so long at it. Maybe I'm feeling my age.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-58198697957074227802008-07-08T10:35:00.000-04:002008-07-08T10:35:00.000-04:00Thanks for the insight, Jessica. I had a very goo...Thanks for the insight, Jessica. I had a very good laugh and the same time as some serious thoughts.<BR/><BR/>Why? I've been told repeatedly by members of a writers' group that my writing and understanding of life will grow as I "mature." Came to find out that several of these well-intentioned folks thought I was 10-15 younger thn my actual age. (It gave almost as good a feeling as when I get carded.)<BR/><BR/>Does ageism exist? Yup, especially in YA.<BR/><BR/>Should it be relevant in this profession? No, because creativity is not ageist.<BR/><BR/>What is old anyway? Every single one of my grandparents "retired" only to pick up a new career because they were bored! A majority of of both the grandparents and the great-grandparents live into their nineties with their mental abilities intact. I've got PLENTY of time to build a career in publishing.Suzan Hardenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04600258874634909988noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-8035951851526981752008-07-08T10:18:00.000-04:002008-07-08T10:18:00.000-04:00Interesting discussion. Believe me, I curse how o...Interesting discussion. Believe me, I curse how old I am everyday. In YA right now you would not believe how many people who are teens and early twenties getting book contracts. <BR/><BR/>Honestly, at 32 there are definitely times I feel as if my ship has already sailed for my genre.<BR/><BR/>I can only hope I look younger than I am. ;o)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23051453.post-8883977334290434252008-07-08T10:12:00.000-04:002008-07-08T10:12:00.000-04:00You ask if, all things being equal, would I choose...You ask if, all things being equal, would I choose an agent who is 25, 45, or 60?<BR/><BR/>In the writer/agent relationship there is so much more than age. Can things really be equal? <BR/><BR/>Is the 60 year old just starting as an agent and so has little experience or publishing relationships? Has the 25 year old worked in NY, doing summer interns for Harper Collins since she was 16? Is the 45 year old getting burned out working 80 hours a week and still trying to make it to all her kids' sporting venues?<BR/><BR/>Finding the right agent involves some things that might be attached to age (experience, motivation, track record, reputation, enthusiasm, energy, the possibility that the agent may be looking at retirement soon) but might not be (I know 85 year olds who travel the world and 25 year olds who can barely get out of bed). <BR/><BR/>It's the personality as much as anything, the chemistry between the writer and the agent that matter just as much as those other things.<BR/><BR/>When a stock broker friend had an elderly client who wanted long-term investments, he told her, "Lady, you shouldn't even be buying green bananas!" But he sold her the stocks anyway, and made himself a tidy commission. And she lived long enough to see the profits and use them.Heidi Willishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18420802651029097379noreply@blogger.com